eBay Desktop Turns 1 Million; Steve Jobs likes “Meat and Potatoes” eBay iPhone App

TheBrewsNewsOn 07.17.2008 at 3:29 pm Said:

“…he also indicated that he didn’t feel like it is a buyer vs. seller approach (a lot of the time eBay users are both) but that every decision made is targeted at the overall user experience.”

Unfortunately, as eBay continues to improve overall user experience, there are LOTS of bugs and glitches. And quite a few eBay buyers are not understanding at all when an eBay bug or glitch causes any problem with the transaction.

So, while eBay “improves” the site they are directly creating a buyer versus seller approach (in direct contradiction to what was stated by eBay) because any new eBay application or “improvement” that doesn’t work as intended means that the eBay buyer takes out their frustrations when rating the eBay seller. Buyers directly hold sellers responsible for site issues that are completely out of seller’s control. Buyers have no other way of expressing their displeasure or frustration because eBay does not have any customer service personnel available to listen to buyer’s complaints about the site (unlike eBay’s competition does).

I guarantee you that eBay’s competition has a well-functionning site because they are direct users of the system. And since eBay is not an actual user of their own site (ie because they do not use their own system to sell product directly to buyers like the competition does), eBay does not have any idea about how deeply impacted sellers are during this “time of eBay site improvement”. eBay is well on its way to improving all the sellers right off the site.

Alan LewisOn 07.17.2008 at 4:25 pm Said:

Hi “Brews”,

I can only speak for myself, but I consider it part of my job to buy and sell on the site (although I do my buying through eBay Desktop, of course). My username is alanlewis0 — I’m closing in on 100 feedback points, and I just bought some more stuff last week.

I use every opportunity to encourage other employees to do so too. We have an internal directory that lists every employee’s, email address and Skype ID, and I have put forth the idea to add everyone’s eBay username to that directory to add some social pressure (embarrass those employees who aren’t active on the site).

-Alan

TheBrewsNewsOn 07.17.2008 at 4:40 pm Said:

Alan,

It looks like you have sold a total of 4 items in 2008 where you received feedback so that means you probably would not have experienced anywhere near the site issues that I might have (someone who averages about sales of thousands of items a month).

Without divulging any employees’ information who does not want their details given out, can you give us some stats on the top 10 eBay employee “sellers”? In other words, how many feedback (as a seller) do these top eBay employees have in the last 12 months and what is their function within the company (ie do they work in Trust&Safety, are they executives, etc)? I would be incredibly surprised to find more than one or two eBay employees that have any real selling experience.

Alan LewisOn 07.17.2008 at 5:09 pm Said:

Brew,

No, I am not a professional seller, but I do know a number of eBay employees who are at that scale. Customer service people, product manager, programmers, and yes, even executives. I am very much a casual seller, and I have been able to supplement my income by selling things I don’t need. I have probably sold more than $2,000 worth of stuff in the past year, so without eBay my financial situation would be a little bit sticky right now (and not just because I would have to look for another job).

One example - the guy who runs Turbo Lister is a professional seller and has been for many years. I wish I had a directory of eBay employee sellers so I could tell you more (again — my idea hasn’t been implemented yet)

While I think it is best if employees buy and sell on the site, and I argue that we as a company should very well require it, it is by no means the only way that we get insight into what happens on the site. I find that a very effective way to get such insight is to talk to as many people as I can about their eBay experience. I travel often - and when I do so I am usually wearing an eBay shirt, and I cannot tell you how many times this has led to conversations with people on the plane, at the airport, or just out and about, regarding what they sell, what they buy, problems that they have had, what they like, don’t like, etc…

There are millions and millions of people who use eBay, and it is our responsibility as stewards to take in every aspect: our own personal experience, aggregate data that we see as employees, stories from members (either through sites like this one or in person). Too often eBay employees have relied on just the data (hey, they are MBAs who love using Excel, so it is what they are good at), and what I’m trying to do is push everyone else to both use eBay more and listen to others who do too.

I hope this isn’t sounding too “employee-ish” of an answer. I genuinely like working here and I’m trying to do my part to make things better. I know things have been rough and I can sympathize with how you have been affected.

-Alan

AmberOn 07.17.2008 at 6:39 pm Said:

every decision made is targeted at the overall user experience.

Thanks for posting, Alan. What I’d like to point out is that most of the new features we’re seeing or that are scheduled here on the site (not with Desktop) have produced HUGE outrage among both buyers and sellers.

From a buyer’s perspective:

Finding 2.0 aka the Playground is a disaster. More and more people have been dropped into it with no way to opt out. It is glitch-ridden and requires WAY too many clicks to get anywhere. The opt-out link often doesn’t work AND has crashed SEVERAL users’ browsers and/or resulted in timed out pages. It’s also extremely slow.

(Store inventory is also being further buried, so choice is limited for buyers)

Best Match. It doesn’t work. It does not return the best results. Ever. Buyers are not finding what they’re looking for despite what the ‘metrics’ may tell the suits. In addition, in my category (books) buyers have to wade through hundreds of thousands of listings by one seller. They tend to give up and go elsewhere rather than fight the search.

The redesigned checkout: It hides offline payment methods and is very glitchy. Often, seller’s addresses for mailed payments are dropped entirely from checkout information. Add that to non-stop Paypal glitches this summer and buyers are getting increasingly frustrated with the time and effort it takes to make a purchase AND pay for it.

I personally love cool tools that work. I don’t use Desktop as I’m primarily a seller, but I do use some of the other cool widgets including eBay to Go. But I’d like to see some of the more serious issues addressed too. A quick look at the search board shows people literally begging for assistance. Experienced eBayers can’t find their way around, so you can imagine how newbies feel.

How do these things improve the user experience? How does it improve the buyer experience to have their chosen payment method hidden? How does it improve user experience when buyers can’t find what they’re searching for?

The new SYI form is awful compared to 2.0, but no one listened to the sellers there either.

Discussion boards are filled with “Give us Feedback about This or That Widget/Search etc” yet the complaints, suggestions, criticisms are ignored. No one is willing to say “okay, this isn’t working, let’s scrap it.” That takes courage, but sometimes, something just doesn’t work right and it’s time to go back to the drawing board. Finding 2.0, Best Match, and the new Checkout are 3 things that should never have made it out of Beta.

TheBrewsNewsOn 07.17.2008 at 7:14 pm Said:

Alan,

It sure would be nice to see examples of real employees selling in a real way on eBay. Every employee I’ve ever read about or spoken to admits to buying on eBay but I have never seen or talked to anyone who sells more than a few items a year on eBay.

Since you know a number of eBay employees who sell on eBay, maybe you could convince a few of them to come on eBayInk and talk about their experiences. I would really like to know how they are handling all the technical glitches and all the eBay policy changes.

Based on the advice eBay puts out in their Powerseller newsletters (advice like “buy from suppliers who have a liberal return policy so you can return items that do not sell on eBay”) and some of the policy changes that are being enacted this year, it appears to many professional sellers that eBay doesn’t have a clue about their customers needs (and I am referring to the sellers who pay eBay fees as customers in this instance).

So it would definitely be nice to hear some real stories from real eBay employees who regularly sell on eBay so that we know they actually can relate to us. I personally would very much welcome their comments, even if they have “employee-ish” things to say.

Randy SmytheOn 07.17.2008 at 9:24 pm Said:

Alan, congratulations on the 1 million downloads. That is quite an accomplishment.

Keep up the good work.
Randy

Alan LewisOn 07.17.2008 at 9:46 pm Said:

Brews,

Excellent idea. I will try my best to get employee/professional sellers to come on Ink to talk to Richard (and all of you).

-Alan

Alan LewisOn 07.17.2008 at 9:46 pm Said:

Randy,

Thanks! It was great to talk to you at eBay Live this year.

Best,
Alan

Scott @ TradingAssistantJournal.comOn 07.18.2008 at 4:01 am Said:

Hello RBH and Alan,

Wow, great info here! I must say I was non plussed by the eBay desktop application because I am a believer in cloud computing web based interfaces. I also found no advantage for sellers within the program. It is good to hear seller functionality is on the way!

The best part of this article for me was Alan’s paraphrased comment:

“having said that, he also indicated that he didn’t feel like it is a buyer vs. seller approach (a lot of the time eBay users are both) but that every decision made is targeted at the overall user experience”.

This view has not been expressed from within eBay Corporate, or at least it has not been effectively communicated outside of San Jose. I think eBay sellers would really like to hear more from employees with inclusive messages like Alan Lewis.

Sellers are uncomfortable with the whole sellers vs buyers class battle. Sure there is friction when it comes to feedback issues and NPB problems but in the end, most all sellers like and appreciate buyers. Sellers need buyers and buyers need sellers but the thing eBay recently seems to have forgotten is that as a company, eBay needs both.

Thanks Richard for bringing this new voice, the voice of Alan Lewis to light. It is a fresh message and eBay needs to follow Mr. Lewis’s lead with the expression of the recognition that sellers and buyers are not mutually exclusive.

HenriettaOn 07.18.2008 at 12:58 pm Said:

I am confused (this appears to be my doom for the day, but)

RBH said “He also pointed out that the interaction on Desktop vs. eBay.com is philosophically different with the former being more personal and the latter being more open and social.”

Desktop is an application I could download, which would improve my buyer experience, correct?
The reference to eBay.com is where I go in my preferred browser if I want to go to eBay?
‘the former being more personal’ = I would tailor the app to my preferences

How is eBay.com open and social? Am I being especially dim today? This is a distinct possibility.

It has been my experience in the past that downloading desktop apps has slowed my CPU. Vast amounts of information are funneled to whichever entity owns the app. and while not exactly malware they are closely related to spyware.

How does this apply to eBay desktop, or does it apply?

HenriettaOn 07.18.2008 at 2:09 pm Said:

How nice to meet you online Alan Lewis. I am impressed by your philosophy and enthusiasm. You make me feel very old, but thats OK.

As a potential buyer I find (maybe I should say I don’t find) it very hard to see the items I want. I know that they are there because I have been around long enough to know that there is more than one way to skin a cat. Your average bored ‘maybe I will go cruise eBay’ buyer gives up.

Yesterday I searched violet cup. Then I excluded chimera, wax, soy, scented, and still weird stuff came up. Why would a gazillion wax pillar candles come up in a search for a cup? Neither word was in the title or description. African violets I understand. Is a two word search ‘either of’? It did not used to be.

Eventually, after a couple of HOURS I found three items that were by the maker and in the pattern I was looking for. Three. One was priced five times the normal, it had free parcel post shipping (4 - 6 weeks transit) but why would I want to pay $50 for a fairly common vintage item that normally sells for between $5 - $7 and ships Priority for $5?

I find best match to be frustrating to say the least. Why should I as a buyer be prevented from finding an item I want because the seller of that item does not meet some eBay algorithm requirement? Would it not be better to simply decline to accept that sellers listing and tell him to go away?

patricia1On 07.18.2008 at 5:54 pm Said:

Darned good question Henrietta. If they want to punish sellers and bury them in the listings they are also punishing buyers AND themselves! If buyers can’t find the item they want they give up or go elsewhere. That’s not good business in my mind. They could think of a better way to punish sellers instead of manipulating search and burying them. I don’t think I’ve come across many buyers who prefer best match - most are frustrated!

MechelleOn 07.19.2008 at 2:38 am Said:

I thought this portion of the Q2 Q&A interesting relative to best match

“Christa Quarles - Thomas Weisel Partners

One question on the marketing side; it seems as if, given the fact that if I go to the page, for example, the only monetization that’s happening above the fold is an ad from Yahoo!, and I was just curious if that’s indicative of its ability to better monetize relative to what you think your listings can monetize, and/or if you think that ultimately improves the buyer experience? Thanks.

John J. Donahoe

Christa, yes, the bottom line is we think our listings, especially as we improve search, are the best way to monetize that above-the-fold real estate. So we do have the graphical display ad from Yahoo! at the top of the page but listings are still monetized most effectively and are consistent with the real core focus on the transaction marketplace.

We’re finding where the text ads really monetize best are on null search results, where in those rare cases we don’t have inventory, or on complementary items that are made to fold down at the bottom, and so overall both text ads and graphical advertising, as Bob said, is growing. We continually test that to make sure what placements optimize our advertising but by and large, above-the-fold listings monetize better.

Christa Quarles - Thomas Weisel Partners

So you think that you can continue to see high double-digit growth, even in this environment, given what’s going on in the display marketplace?”

John J. Donahoe

Prior to best march I had never experienced a “null” search return. I have since found myself wondering where the heck all the products are since best match and had assumed it was due to the decline in sellers - and their merchandise. However, now I am reconsidering my assumptions.

I have always recognized that Best Match served only to increase conversion rates for eBay’s fee collection (display those items under conditions with the highest frequency of conversion). It never crossed my mind that they were manipulating search to increase revenue from CTR. That is pretty freaking low!!