eBay Australia announces Safe Payment Initiative

Kevin_T / April 9th, 2008 at 6:38 pm

QUOTE: “Plus, eBay data (note to self: how do I get my hands on this data?) shows that in 2007 people who paid with PayPal were four times less likely to enter a dispute than people who paid with bank deposit.”

Is that based on flat numbers, or percentage of transactions?

PayPal has never particularly gotten a foothold in Australia as a significant proportion of buyers (and domestic sellers) have preferred to use direct deposit. If the quote is based on flat numbers, I wouldn’t doubt that the proportions are similar. If so, Ebay benefits as they earn an additional commission on both the sale, and on the postage charges by forcing all transactions to use PayPal. There are no direct fees on using direct deposit with Australian banks.

In June we will see how many sellers (and buyers) drop from the Australian site because they do not wish to deal with PayPal, and how many Australian sellers list in US dollars so that they can accept a broader range of payment options.

I am yet to decide how this announcement will affect my own business model. It will effectively substantially increase my fees on my Ebay Australia auctions, as I don’t currently use PayPal on those listings. There are many other implications about this announcement I am yet to absorb and address.

Regards, Kevin (in Australia)

Scott @ TradingAssistantJournal / April 9th, 2008 at 8:50 pm

Richard,

I think I will have to side with Davey on this announcement. This seems to be a very arrogant and foolish move when merchants are exploring secondary channels in greater numbers every day.

PayPal has its benefits and yet also presents numerous problems for sellers and buyers alike. Some are PayPal fans, others are not. But to limit payment options for both buyers and sellers on any online ecommerce site in this way seems counter productive.

Buyers and sellers can find options now easier than ever before. Restricting those options to only one payment method would seem to encourage both to look for those other options more quickly. Is ebay really trying to encourage both to look elsewhere?

If this policy spills over to the USA or UK, I would say that Stephanie Tilenius was right when she intimated that we hadn’t seen nothin yet!

The resulting firestorm of implementing this type of policy in the USA or UK will be vast and intense.

Chris @ TameBay / April 10th, 2008 at 1:27 am

“I’ve been told that there are no plans to go to a PayPal-only model for eBay in other markets – US included”

And did you believe that? Haven’t they warned you about eBay speak yet? ;-)

If you look at the marketplaces around the world they start off without PayPal, when they get to a million or so items on the site they add PayPal, when they get established users are pushed more and more towards PayPal and now we have eBay Australia going PayPal only.

“No plans” is simply another term for “no timescales”. It’ll happen one day soon. The question is will it be a bad thing?

bonni / April 10th, 2008 at 2:43 am

And when someone sells an expensive item with PayPal, are they going to get their account frozen and have to go through the monumental hassle of “proving” they’re legitimate?

Also, what’s being done to protect sellers from unscrupulous buyers who claim an item is “not as described” and send back not the item but an empty box, and then are given their money back by PayPal, leaving the seller out the money AND the expensive item?

Is PayPal going to start CONSISTENTLY accepting Australia Post Registered mail as proof of postage? Will they start to accept Australia Post international insured post for international transactions?

There are so many problems with this isn’t not even funny, and it’s yet more proof that eBay are totally out of touch with their sellers.

Kitty / April 10th, 2008 at 4:49 am

eBay is doing this because the laws in Australia allow it to do so. Once it monopolizes the payment method, could a huge fee increase be far behind?
Unfortunately I think the answer will be yes.
I’m in the USA and I hope anti-trust laws will prevent this situation from happening here.
Even though most of my customers do pay in Paypal, choice in shipping and payment methods are the hallmarks of a free market.
EBay must choose whether it is just a venue, or take control of the site. Manually remove all the fraud.
Make us buyers and sellers feel like we are getting something for its high fees and manipulative searches.

Randy Smythe / April 10th, 2008 at 7:43 am

Amazon requires Amazon payments for purchases on their platform but they’ve done this from the beginning. eBay is adding on all these layers of regulation to the marketplace that was celebrated for being “just a venue” Is it any wonder people are upset.

It like bringing the law to the Wild West

Patricia 1 / April 10th, 2008 at 10:10 am

Richard – perhaps they want both – but they don’t want retail from ebay. I buy from solid retail companies and now I like the idea that they are all online. Recently bought a new vacuum from Walmart online and my Wacom drawing tablet from Best Buy online. I believe in companies that will be there when I have a complaint…no hassles. In that respect, Amazon provides that security….ebay does not. However, when I broke my corningware baking dish circa 1963 I went to ebay and got a replacement in new condition. Same with my corningware teapot – which isn’t even made anymore…back to ebay. That was such a pleasurable transaction that I actually wrote the seller twice to let her know how utterly pleased I was to find that pot and pleased with her service. Right now I’m replacing pieces of my Oneida silverware circa 1963 and getting those on ebay as well. THESE are the things that made ebay famous and what we sellers are fighting for. I want ebay to stay out of retail and leave it to the big stores who do it so capably! I don’t think that’s so hard to understand. Ebay has no customer service to speak of and a really dubious reputation for scammers and fraud – they need to be working on improving that aspect of their business instead of looking toward a retail situation.

Randy Smythe / April 10th, 2008 at 10:44 am

Richard, I want both versions. eBay “Classic” and the “New” eBay – you could even call it Express :).

Make it happen okay!

RKS

TW / April 10th, 2008 at 11:17 am

“I’ve been told that there are no plans to go to a PayPal-only model for eBay in other markets – US included.”

I wish I could believe this. We know the PayPal must be required as a payment method is coming soon.

TW / April 10th, 2008 at 11:23 am

“So, which is it that people want? eBay to be more like Amazon; eBay 2008 to be more like eBay 1998; or a streamlined combo of the two?”

I want an eBay classic site and eBay to quit trying to be Amazon which they will fail at with their current level of customer service.

At the very least I want to know that eBay will always have an auction format with a more reasonable price structure. I also want eBay to allow me to run my business the way I want to which means accepting which form of payment I want to.

Lurch / April 10th, 2008 at 1:13 pm

Yes – definitely more like 1998. In service, attitude (especially attitude from eBay’s side), usability for both buyer and seller, encouragement of people to stay on the site (and not via silly social networking and blogging tools – but by getting them to actual be encouraged to look around at listings), actually making it fun again for all (and no, having a “Back for more fun?” above the login box don’t make it so), and I could go on. I’m not bothering to get as detailed as Patricia’s post, because there’s still been no follow-up to my comment/question on the other blog entry (Catalyst Conference). Someone might want to think about closing comments on older posts if no one is going to check back on them. I’d also let people know how long comments will be open for a specific entry…

Then again – given the fact that it sounds like you’re pretty much new to eBay, do you have any idea what it was like in 1996? or 1997? or 1998?

Sharon / April 10th, 2008 at 1:49 pm

We want Ebay 1998 back, only with a company that recognizes that as Ebay grows, so will the fraud. Bad buyers learned to scam the system, bad sellers also.

More often than not, when a situation is reported to Ebay, all that is ever sent is a canned response totally unrelated to the topic at hand. Customer service is at an all time low.

We want Ebay back with the recent changes reversed, i.e. Only positives for buyers, DSR’s, Best Match,etc. Sellers need to have the ability to leave negatives or neutrals for buyers. Many times this is the only protection sellers do have. It forces buyers to atleast work with us.

We want customer service that will deal with the real problems that we face on Ebay. To police the site and deal with the fraud.

Recognize that there are bad sellers who use feedback wrongly and remove them. Just as there are some bad buyers who need removed.

Stop with the multiple ID insanity. I know that Ebay has our IP addresses, use that to tie all ID’s together and to prohibit bad buyers and sellers from simply getting another ID, after being suspended. It happens way too often.

If Ebay insists on exploring retail, which I don’t think will work, then separate the two. An Ebay classic and an Ebay Retail Division.

We want Ebay back. There are many people who depend on Ebay for their income. These changes are coming at a bad time what with the economy such as it is. Many people are desperate and just want Ebay to Listen!

Just my two cents worth.

Kevin_T / April 10th, 2008 at 2:33 pm

Richard,
Forget 1998 or 2008, Ebay should simply be a service and a tool with which I can run a reliable small international business. I am happy to pay for that service, but I do not want Ebay INTERFERING with either my business or with the marketplace in general.

I appreciate that Ebay has moved on from it’s “just a venue” stance, and that it needs to control aspects of the site that will allow fraud, but it should not be trying to dominate MY business (and that MY stands for the individual business of each and every seller), it should not be throwing up constant change which everyone has to adjust to, and interferes with productivity and sales (and affects Ebay’s own bottom line). We do not work for Ebay, we pay them a fair price for providing a service. Whilst no-one complains about Amazon’s payment service, it was always there – Ebay offered the ability for business or private sellers to use their own terms and payment methods according to what they found appropriate for their own business. Ebay prospered because of this, but now is trying to impose their will on all businesses as though they don’t realise that they are only a service provider.

Ebay needs to realise that every time they change rules, make the site harder to use, or remove payment options which will make some buyers leave the site, that they are affecting livelihoods. Ebay need to consider changes BEFORE they make them, and how they impact on the businesses that are paying for the service. Don’t threaten us with bolder and bigger changes more often, promise us a simple trading platform where we can work efficiently, create a better turnover, and Ebay can simply reap more fees and commissions. Don’t threaten to raise fees at any time, stick with annual fee adjustments so that businesses can budget and work to a business plan. Oh, and try to understand that the people who pay the fees and commissions to Ebay are actually their clients – many announcements nowadays treat sellers like criminals and the buyers like Ebay’s clients. Yes, the buyers are very important in the marketplace, but the sellers are the ones who are paying for Ebay’s services and are running the businesses that attract the buyers.

The Australian market will be adversely affected by the changes to payments allowed on Ebay. Some buyers will leave and some prices will fall (we won’t know which parts of the market will be affected until specific buyers dissappear). Ebay will make up the shortfall through the additional income from PayPal, but the businesses that are selling on the site get the worst of both – lower prices for their auction goods and increased fees because they are not allowed to accept payments which cost nothing to process, and which some buyers prefer. Livelihoods and business models will be affected by this, and this is not the business structure we were enticed to the site with.

After 10 years on Ebay, I am currently considering my future as an online seller. There SHOULD be no reason for me to do so, but I prefer to work for myself rather than being treated like an untrustworthy employee by someone who *I* am paying.

I am frustrated and dissappointed with what Ebay is doing to the marketplace.

Richard, I do thank you for taking the time to at least try to analyse and listen to the responses that you are receiving – that aspect is appreciated.

Kind Regards, Kevin

Brenda / April 10th, 2008 at 5:35 pm

Sarah,

I have only bought so far on Ebay. Being tech challenged it is easier for me to call someone. I am thankful that Paypal has phone service. Unfortunately out of 4 phone calls made to Paypal mistakes were made by the phone reps 2 out of the 4 times I called creating follow up time that I had to lose by doublechecking the information. 50% isn’t an acceptable standard.

I can’t risk a 21 day payment hold to a company that has shown me only a 50% accuracy rate while doing business on a venue that doesn’t have viable customer service until certain levels of performance are met. Would you trust this situation if you were me? If yes why

Davey / April 10th, 2008 at 8:07 pm

@Richard,

I don’t know if I’ve said this before, but I not only sell, I also buy (and very large-ticket items too). I walk both sides of the aisle.

What disturbs sellers about the eBay/Paypal functional monopoly gets back to the absolutely, indescribably, bottom feeding (I feel like Clark Griswold on Chirstmas Vacation here), horribly poor customer service of either one, leading to the lack of trust on the part of sellers or buyers. The next problematic root area is the denigration of the feedback “trust” system. Both problems point to the abandonment of Pierre’s original Community Values by eBaY corporate. When eBay pays lip service to trust issues, they reciprocally lose that trust from their customer base.

You buy from a merchant or private seller because you perceive they and their product have integrity, first and foremost. People and organizations who have integrity don’t need a safety net for those they interact with. Buyers are also proud of their integrity, and want it recognized and respected. A good, bidirectional feedback system, when it still worked, was an assurance of that integrity. Every sale also has a bit of caveat emptor for buyers and sellers alike (I don’t know the latin for “seller beware”), even with a B&M business. But, people found fit to trust each other, did their research, and part of the joy of the marketplace was that Pierre’s ideas REALLY WORKED!

Paypal in its early days was a breeze to use, and although you had some payment holds and glitches, I found that if you had a problem, you could get someone that would understand the problem and dealt with it fairly. This is no longer so. Lurch noted that eBay/auctionweb likewise was approachable and took the ideas of their community as being important to their growth.

Now, Paypal is very dangerous for sellers–extremely dangerous. Much more so than a merchant account, which the sellers of Australia will not be able to use anymore. For buyers, Paypal has fewer pitfalls than for sellers, save the “glitches” that pop up like the current chronic payment priority bug that has been around for 2 months or more. For sellers, more and more stories pop up of arbitrary claims decisions that defy logic and cannot be appealed for independent review, holds that can go on up to 180 days for secretive reasons, limited rights of data submission to support a seller’s position in a claim, and the like. A buyer SNAD claim, the hardest to defent against, is a nearly sure loss for a seller of everything from the item, shipping, and listing fees. And of course the brain-dead cusomter service does nothing but anger an aggrieved buyer or seller! Dishonest buyers are starting to take advantage of Paypal and shipping loopholes, which drive up sellers’ losses. Sellers are taking economy shipping off of the buyers’ choice list (raising prices) because of the losses they can suffer by using it and buyers cannot be trusted to take on responsibility for their chosen shipping type and inherent risks thereof. I could go on and on over stunts Paypal has pulled on me alone that would amaze even a third grader, and I’m only a 1/2 Powerseller.

I won’t comment on the executive team that grew eBay, but I think other than keeping them adequately capitalized through growth, I don’t see much of anything Meg did that made the marketplace any healthier at all. Of course she made herself and some of the other management fabulously rich, but community members began to sense the base principles of eBay changing from “What do we do to be mutually successful,” to “What can I do to bring in more net revenue at any cost to my community?” Customer service went to computerized responses that are mostly worthless and care-less (and customers see that immediately and scorn any business that would treat them that way). Then, other problems that popped up on the marketplace were dealth with in kneejerk ways that tried to minimize any use of judgement on the part of a human being. Suggestions for simple ways to change things that needed to be changed were ignored, which gave the appearance of extreme arrogance. Fraud was swept under the rug and never talked about publically.

Yes, I want eBay something-less-than-2006. It worked, it grew (even though every business cannot grow infinitely large), and it was enjoyable. The current eBay doesn’t recognize who its customers are, take care of them, and does not appear to care who they are anyway.

Incidentally, when you are talking internally, ask why Google Payments is not considered “safe.” If you look at that objectively, you should see that the “safe” does not consider the buyer nor the seller, but eBay’s bottom line and control of the sale.

oakteak / April 10th, 2008 at 8:54 pm

Sadly, I think the theme of most of these posts is that eBay is not trustworthy and even worse, is non-responsive, and quite frankly arrogant about it.

Whether this is true or not, I don’t know. But if that is the impression that is being transmitted, then something is seriously wrong with the business model you have chosen or have evolved into.

I don’t think any business can operate in that kind of atmosphere.

Your sellers and your buyers are trying to make you see the light because they really care about what is happening to eBay!

You are closing your eyes and ears.

It is time to do some soul searching about the health of your business. And I mean you have to look at everything, warts and all. Forget that a change is someone’s pet project. If it isn’t working, for Heaven’s sake get rid of it. And maybe get rid of little Johnny or Janie who thought it up.

I think it’s Jack Welch time. Time to get rid of the mummies in the back room.

Davey / April 10th, 2008 at 9:29 pm

@Richard

Thanks for bringing Sarah here. Hopefully the staff participants begin to realize we’re all not all whining nuts, but people who know the marketplace by being in it deeply (unlike some prominent eBay management members who mainly buy shoes here) and experiencing the joys and flaws of it.

I did forget to comment on your intro point #2, that data shows that sellers using Paypal are half as likely to have an unpaid item. This really has no connection to the infamous Seller Protection Program.

Here’s a thought–I’d much rather have my item remain unpaid than paid, shipped, and the payment reversed later in a Paypal claim…

Of course, eBay would rather have my item get “paid” (they keep the Final Value Fees if the item is not claimed as unpaid, and by the time a payment is reversed, the timeframe to claim an unpaid item and get my fees back has long passed). Beyond that, well, Paypal only cares if I complied with the SPP to the letter. For domestic shipments, that is pretty easy to do and prove delivery. Internationally, much harder without soaking your buyer for expensive shipping, and restricting countries if you are not a Powerseller. Of course, the infamous SNAD claim is almost impossible to defend whether domestic or not, and you may or may not get your goods back.

Prior to the Paypal economy, these trades were done based on integrity. The flakes usually became obvious quickly. Risks were shared between buyer and seller. Can’t do that anymore when buyer feedback is always positive!

The economics that drive shipping choices, insurance purchase by the seller (there is NO incentive for insurance purchase by the buyer if bought through Paypal), and the like are multivariate and include DSR punishment, item cost, risk tolerance, etc. SPP is another variable. Allowing economy shipping was a win-win for me and my buyers. Now, not so much.

Davey / April 10th, 2008 at 9:45 pm

One last gasp for tonight–my comments on fraud and fraud management as relates to Paypal and feedback:

When in Town Halls or other meetings where thorny questions of seller protection arise, Someone, often Tom Halprin, breezily says that sellers must chose and continue to use whatever fraud management systems fit their business.

As as smaller seller, I had one, and only one system available–reliable buyer feedback. As of May 1st, I don’t have even that threadbare system anymore as eBay intervened and took it from me.

Paypal hides fraud-judging data from me as a seller, such as credit card CVV, buyer address data, and other fraud metrics that they use. They do the fraud searching for me, as a service I guess. Of course, I can’t opt out of some of the more fraud-laden payment types within Paypal.

Sometimes, though, they have the courtesy to tell me, after the payment has cleared, they’ve authorized shipment, and the package is gone, that they decided my customer is a fraud risk or they had trouble securing the actual funds, so they lift the money back out of my account. OK, what do I do now? Well, if it is an international shipment that I sent with First Class International at the customer’s choice (for economy) or it is to a non-covered country, I likely just lost everything in the sale. If domestic, I’m probably OK under SPP.

I won’t summarize the obvious here, but you can draw some more conclusions why sellers may not like mandatory Paypal, forcing acceptance of more fraud-laden payment types, or the loss of leaving buyers negative feedback. The latter, particularly, seems to escape some eBay management, whose bonuses remain the same whether I lose on a sale or not.

Davey / April 10th, 2008 at 9:55 pm

OK, a last, last gasp!

I read OAKTEAK’s post above, again, and saw something I missed, that I agree with.

Let no one doubt here that I feel very strongly about wanting eBay’s future to be strong. I want buyers to come, and feel good about visiting. What seller doesn’t? In that way, we agree completely with eBay’s management.

What grieves me is that management completely devalues me in about every interaction and policy change. Their vision certainly does not take me into account, other than in a patronizing way.

Brenda / April 11th, 2008 at 4:10 am

There is so much here!

I don’t remember which topic had had a reference to prioritizing the issues,but they all seem to revolve around one very important theme.

TRUST

I have read commentary repeatedly about the comparisons being made betwwen Ebay and Amazon. Posters are asked, with a certain level of confusion attached, ” What do you want, Retail a la Amazon or Ebay ‘98? ”

What people want is to feel:

SAFE
APPRECIATED
VALUED

People like Amazon’s professioal approach.
People like Amazon’s forthright policies.
People like Amazon’s customer service.
People like Amazon’s consistancy.
People like Amazon’s standardized procedures.
People like Amazon’s willingness to hold up their end of the bargain.
People like Amazon’s clarity.

And I think that people appreciate Amazon’s ability to create a business plan and work out the kinks before experimenting and testing business theories on the public.

How much input does Ebay need from the public in order to figure out how to organize themselves?

The top tier could always registar as sellers. I am not saying to do this large scale, but put a few items up and work the sales under the same conditions as are being placed upon the NEW SMALL SELLER. And do this without pulling rank so you can experiance firsthand what your sellers are.

Under my proposed idea, you are not allowed any of the perks of Power Seller status. Unless it is possible to anonamously email customer service ( the advantage would still be yours since you designed policy ). And no one can know that you are doing this or it is no longer a valid means of testing out your theories.

The public has a quirky little habit of not realizing that they are a statistical outlier that is not going to make the graph. Mathimatical theories will only go so far when dealing with the diversity of John Q. Public.

Another in house test could be to bid on something. Make sure that you pick a seller with questioable feedback and ask alot of questions. Send payment slowly, find fault with the item and don’t use Paypal.

These 2 steps could be a very efficient means of testing the theoretical waters. Is anybody game?

How much potential harm to the company is all of this public debate causing? It has become almost impossible to go anywhere within the E-commerce arena, within the internet, without being bombarded with a continual commentary about the ILLS OF EBAY.

It seems like there is alot of concern about fraud being brought up. Well, the criminal element is being educated by all of this public debate. They have to stay state of the art too.

Patricia 1 / April 11th, 2008 at 9:30 am

Richard….don’t know if I’m in the proper thread for this but can you please pass on to the powers that be that hits are down terribly in the Arts categories since changing to Best Match default. I see no reason for Best Match at all in the arts categories because we have extensive item specifics so a simple search will do. We also noticed that Best Match doesn’t really seem to be favoring artists with great reputations or even powerseller status and the searches we’ve conducted brought back miserable results. Surely with the reduced hits (and bids) ebay is also losing revenue from this. I’ve heard nothing but complaints on the Art & Artist’s Board and the groups I belong to. I’d appreciate it if you would please pass this on. Thanks.

Lurch / April 11th, 2008 at 11:10 am

Richard – that wasn’t a rhetorical question, so thank you. The other part was:

“And if it does go anywhere, do the eBay reps here have any appreciation of how someone who has been around since the very start of eBay might have useful insights in present situations along with ways to remedy them in a way applicable to the present, but keeping in mind what has worked and what has failed in the past – how history can play a role in shaping the future (if any) of eBay?”

I’m try to figure out whether it’s worth the time to participate here at any kind of meaningful level, or if I do, whether it will be simply dismissed – thus, a complete waste of my time, which is what I have learned is the case over the last 8 or so years. You do have to understand, when you are ignored and dismissed over such a long period of time, one just sort of gives up and becomes extremely wary of wasting their (my) time.

Oh yeah – is there any kind of internal dictate that people in other departments need to listen AND respond to you? Will anything here actually be considered and possibly incorporated in the future planning for eBay? It’s too bad there’s no ombudsman at eBay. Hint, hint.

I’ve made this offer before, but I am potentially open to direct communication if the answer to these three questions is “yes.”

Thanks!

Ann / April 11th, 2008 at 11:17 am

Richard,

As a Power Buyer and Silver Power Seller who has been using eBay for nearly 12 years, since the beginning, and someone who reads the blogs both on and off eBay, professional writers (such as AuctionBytes) and personal ones; I CAN TELL you EXACTLY what eBay members want.

1) They want eBay to return to what they have always claimed to be: a Venue. eBay has gotten so far from that and so involved in every aspect of each transaction that they can no longer claim the legal safety net of being a venue only. Get out of our businesses and provide the service we are paying for – a place to transact OUR business.

2) They want eBay to be a safe place to do business. They want it separated from PayPal. They want choices in what payments to accept, what payment methods to offer, what shippers to use and so on. PayPal is not “the only safe way to pay”. In fact, it is the least secure method of payment for a seller. Thieves, scammers and dishonest buyers abound and use PayPal almost exclusively. I have been screwed more times by PayPal than I can count and have lost thousands of dollars to dishonest buyers who exploit PayPal’s loopholes and “Buyer Protection” bias. SPP is a complete joke. Nearly every serious seller I’ve talked to or listened to say the same. In more than 10 years on eBay, the ONLY payment problems I’ve ever had were with PAYPAL buyers or PayPal itself stealing from me.

3) PayPal’s new User Agreement in the US that goes into effect May 7th is a license to STEAL and is blatently illegal. I’ve already contacted an attorney about it and they state we have grounds for a class action lawsuit if PayPal tries to put Section 13.5 (b) ito effect. It states that if a buyers claims an item is not as described, PayPal will require the item to be returned to PAYPAL, NOT THE SELLER! The money, including the shipping fees which the seller has Already Spent on behalf of and at the request of the buyer will be returned to the Buyer. The seller is out the money AND the item AND additionally they lose the money they spent in good faith for shipping. PayPal states very clearly, they will NOT RETURN the item to the seller. That is outright theft. In some cases, it qualifies as Felony Grand Larceny!

4) They want eBay to get rid of the bad sellers but also the bad buyers!!! Which far outnumber the bad sellers. Sellers value their reputation and therefore are much more concerned about their feedback and try to keep it good. However, buyers couldn’t care less if they get a negative, all they have to do is snipe an auction and the seller would never even get a chance to look at their feedback before they are roped into a transaction with a bad buyer.

5) Sellers want eBay to support them. They are eBay’s customers after all, not the buyers. The buyers are the sole customer of the seller, not eBay. Sellers are continually being screwed by eBay every which way. As sellers exit in mass to other sites such as Amazon, eCrater, iOffer, eBid, OnlineAuction.com, Overstock and more, the buyers are starting to follow them, while eBay constantly has to advertise to get new buyers to replace those leaving. Buyers will come if the sellers are there. Without the sellers, there are no buyers.

6) “Buyer Experience” is the biggest joke ever. As a Power Buyer, my buying experience has actually gotten much worse since 2005 when Donahoe was hired. Neither sellers or buyers are stupid. We recognize that Donahoe has no experience in either buying or selling on eBay and it shows in every decision he’s made. All of them bad for both buyers and sellers. Best Match is the worst thing ever for buyers. Now they can’t even FIND the items they came looking for and so they leave and go to Amazon et al.

7) They want the “flea market” experience. That is what made eBay great. If they want a “retail” experience, they go to a retail site, they don’t even consider eBay. When they want a collectible, a unique item, an antique or hard to find or discontinued item, they come to eBay. When they want a great item at a less than retail price, they come to eBay. If they want new, mass market items, they go to Wal-mart!

8) They want customer service. They want people to listen to them. They want to be able to talk to a live person (who speaks English and doesn’t live 1/2 a world away) and have them actually care and try to help. They hate automated responses and canned scripts.

9) They want open, honest feedback. They hate hidden anonymous DSR scores. They want sellers to be able to give feedback as well so good buyers can be difereniated from bad. If eBay is worried about retaliatory feedback from sellers, they should be worried about false retaliatory feedback and out-of-control extortion from buyers as well. The only sane solution is to allow both to submit honest feedback for the other side but do not allow it to be visible to either side until both have left it.
Sellers will leave good feedback for good buyers if they are not threatened by the risk of no longer being able to warn others about bad buyers. Talk in the eBay community among sellers is that they will either no longer leave feedback at all for buyers or preface bad “forced positive” feedback with the word NEG or NEGATIVE as well, so people can be warned away from the bad seed buyers anyway. Its the only way left to them to protect themselves from eBay’s bad decisions. Right now, the way eBay’s proposed feedback system is being set up, it will lose all value for both sides, esp if eBay persists with the threat that if a seller chooses not to leave VOLUNTARY positive feedback for a buyer, that eBay WILL DO IT FOR THEM!!

10) Above all, all eBayers want FAIRNESS from eBay towards both sides in all aspects of a transaction. eBay’s bias right now is so far in favor of the buyer that the scales are almost at a vertical tilt.

11) They want fair charges for services provided. They don’t want “fee decreases” that actually raise the total cost! They want honesty from eBay, not doubletalk lies. They want to be able to run their businesses without interference. They want eBay to be reliable, easy-to-use, easy to search (get rid of the Best Match fiasco which doesn’t work) and easy to buy and sell on.

There are many more, but you get the gist. In short, they want the eBay pre-2005. They DON’T want what they are getting now: ignorant deaf executives interested only in lining their own pockets and digging their own graves. They want admissions of mistakes by management and rollbacks of bad choices on eBay’s part.

Give us back the eBay we Used to know and love. If it ain’t broke, don’t break it.

Davey / April 11th, 2008 at 12:03 pm

Ann, is this a good summary of how you feel?

eBay 2005 == New Coke

Coca Cola’s management was astute enough to see the misstep and admit it, so they got their customers back more loyal than ever, and a whole new appreciation for their business. Their business was not to be a better Pepsi…hint, hint… They misread their own data that caused the debacle.

I agree with Ann totally, by the way.

CrunchyPostingGoodness / April 11th, 2008 at 10:40 pm

“Davey – in conversations I’ve had today, it’s pretty evident that this is seen as an entirely positive step forward to strengthen consumer safety on eBay.com.au.”

@ Richard, I think the above comment is exactly what many people were afraid of when this blog was created. eBay is telling you one thing, but the reality is completely different. There are several websites on the internet which give very specific instructions on how one can go about scamming a seller on eBay using the loopholes which exist in PayPal.

I hope that you will rely more on the information that is being provided to you by actual users of eBay, rather than just standard corporate PR. It would make absolutely no sense for eBay to tell you, “Yes, we are aware that this will lead to more scams on sellers, but as long as we still collect our fees and drive up the website traffic it is an acceptable risk for us.”

“Amazon requires Amazon payments for purchases on their platform but they’ve done this from the beginning.”

Amazon also has a more trusted payment system with security for both buyers and sellers. With Amazon every ship to address is considered “confirmed” – unlike PayPal. Amazon also has an educated, live help department to handle any disputes – unlike PayPal. PayPal has a long way to go before sellers will trust it like they trust Amazon’s payment service.

@ Richard, BTW – What is preventing eBay from making all buyer addresses confirmed for all sellers? If the ability exists for eBay to make all buyer addresses confirmed for PowerSellers, then they should be able to confirm them for all sellers. Amazon is able to offer this protection to all of their sellers, so why can’t eBay?

If it is eBay’s intention to provide a better buying experience, then confirming all addresses would increase the number of sellers wishing to ship internationally and therefore create a larger selection for international buyers to choose from.